On wfd , when I release I have no arch . Playing back video it all looks like a line drive . When the  56 hits the ground it bounces another 6 ft and 10 or so for the 28 "and on soft ground". This tells me I have alot more footage left on my throws if I can correct this problem . At the field where I throw there is a hill with a sudden steep climb about 65 or so deg . I am thinking about throwing against this hill at the begining of wfd practice to see how far UP the hill I can get it . I believe this might help get me in the habbit of pulling from the hole and putting arch on it . Has anyone else had or have this problem . Any suggestions would be great .

BAND AID APPROACH: HIGHER CAST

REAL FIX=

1) you can use the wt too inrease your speed "if" its at your shoulder level on the initial cast.

2) 17/20 is correct about dropping into 2nd turn , hwver I would suggest dropping the center of MASS into the 1rst turn 

3) IF the wt passes yourbelly button (COM) on the cast your left side can relax and move FASTER  because you are UN-weighted.

BAND AID APPROACH: HIGHER CAST

REAL FIX=

yeah I agree that a high cast helps, ken lowther comes to mind when i think of a guy who threw far but could have thrown farther in the weights especially earlier in his career if he would have fixed his cast......now with that said if you cast high you must have the ability to sit and hold the position with your legs similiar to a hammer thrower countering the cast. Ken was super stroong and threw far with his technique but I think he had to work harder at it because the weight was not allowed to do what it should have (in my opinion) If you cast high and are straight legged then your center of gravity is too high and the weight will control you.  I was a somewhat discus thrower at one time and i threw without a descent cast for a while, but then I started playing around with the cast and the sit and pivot and keeping the thighs tight and it started to take off.  A discus is light and will naturally go through a pendulum motion with the sprint phase of the throw but the weights require a lil bit of help..we are talking about a twenty or fifty pound difference in the implements. 

All of this is relative and I hope it helps.

Brock

1 : one of the hereditary social classes in Hinduism that restrict the occupation of their members and their association with the members of other castes

transitive verb 1 a : to cause to move or send forth by throwing <cast a fishing lure> <cast dice>

kthxbye.

If I were to use an example : Matt Sanford  As a former hammer thrower either he OR his coach (or both) fiqured this out !

WHY would you ever LIFT your center of mass (DURING the throw)  what goes UP must come down and this takes time and lowers velocity !!!   Its not an opinion ...its PHYSICS !!!

  Wow , It feels like Christmas has come  early this year . What a Who's  who of responses . Thanks guys !  I was able to take advantage of the weather yesterday and throw . I tried several of your suggestions . I tried casting a little higher to start . I found out very quickly what casting to high will do . It felt like I was gonna be pulled through the ground when it bottomed out . It did feel though starting w/ a higher cast "shoulder level"set me up correctly and carried over to pull higher into the sprint better and so on . I felt the biggest difference in the lightweight . When I hit the power position I popped my head up "somthing I was also not doing ,"pulled and the weight  ripped out of my hand way to the right and about went in the creek !Anyway after measuring it was a pr by about 2ft . I believe if I could have held on it would have been a massive Pr. But I think thats was the feeling Baab was talking about . Mr. Baron my left foot is actually about a foot in front of my Right upon releasing . Could this cause an early release? Anyway something else to work on also . I think after I work a little more my timing I'll be better w/ the 56 and I will see higher numbers there as well .

Again thanks to all !

Mike , after reviewing your vid I see what you were saying . Although I wouldn't have noticed unles you pointed out . All I can say is your a beast to be able to do what you do after the work youve had done. I think I finish my throw 98% of the time pushing off my front lead leg . After watching vid of myself and comparing to others I am not pushing off that back leg near enough. It maybe due to "as Alan mentioned in my second turn I am almost standing straight up and by the time I reach my power position the weight has pulled me more on to the front leg before release . I got a snazzy new vid camera so I will post some on you tube soon . Maybe I can get ya'lls thoughts then .

btw. all hail the geezer class . I hope I can still pour it to it in my late 40's and 50's

Thanks for the shout out, Deakion, but my LWFD probably isn't something you should emulate

I pretty much have the biggest differential in the weights of any pro right now. I once threw the HW 45'4 and the LW 74 in the same competition. I have still yet to master the timing in the LW and it remains the most frustrating event for me. I can't use my HW tech for my LW b/c of the speed of the implement.

finally got a video camera that will upload to the computer . Heres some footage I shot today throwing the 28 &56 . I tried throwing up the sharp hill at the park concentrating on getting it further up the hill . Naturally the throws w/ the higher release went further up the hill . Here are the links . Any of you that could reveiw and give some feedback would be great . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hg89sjrythg - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hg89sjrythg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-gddk9i0sU - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-gddk9i0sU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYWtXhZDaB8 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYWtXhZDaB8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiOH-e64lns - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiOH-e64lns