I have seen that technique before, it's called "ELVIS LEG SYNDROME".

mike check your pm

Roy Bogue wrote: OOOOOOOOOH, it's a secret apparently......

thats what i was thinking.

LarryBrock wrote: sorry roy i am just not stuck in front of my computer all day I do actually have a job outside of this lucrative sport....I know its hard to imagine

I thought the power bar endorsemnets, and tacky paid the bills.

LarryBrock wrote: I told mike that I use to watch what Karl Dodge did and try to do it but i was not a very good athlete so i had to adjust.then I saw this guy named Roy Bouge and I knew his exceptional skill in the 56#wfd so i tried to copy his technique and thats where the footwork came from.  Tight footwork in the back of the trig and then drive the front. I watche dRoy Bogue at Loch Norman one year and even tried to copy his boy band good looks and I failed at that as well.

smartass.  

BAAAABalicious,  I think I only fouled ya once.  Most will tellya,  If I call a foul on ya then you fouled.  I am quite liberal as a judge.  Your just to damn big with huge feet flying around in there.  It was all a blur.  You know in a good way.

And Yes Dan, Likely one of the 8-12 times I threw 39 11"    

Karl threw over 90' with the 3 spins - there is great UHA video of him doing it at one of the last Fredericksburg games...I believe he was the first American to break 90' as well (with 3 spins). He later improved his mark with the 2 spins I think

when he went back to two - he did start his feet at around the 7'6 line and then landed the first spin back at the 9' line giving a ton of room to spirint to the front.

It was also his particular technique in the weights (primarily the 56) that ruined his throwing arm elbow and contributed to his early retirement - which by the way he eventually got healed by acupunture - after years of nothing else working.

Dave & Will, you guys are correct...Karl did throw farther with two 91'7 or thereabouts at the Highland Ranch Games.  His Heavy was 47'11 3/4 at the Kiowa Games. 

Karl wasn’t very consistent with the 3 turn, so the change to 2 turns was more practical at the time.  To be honest, he could’ve thrown with any technique and thrown far...he was very dynamic and had a natural feel in that event.

Dave Brown has messed around out here with 3turns and done very well, upper 80's. But again, he can use any style and throw far...he's just a freak of nature...I mean a great athlete.

Speed to the trig:

If you want speed to the trig you need to achieve two main things:

#1. As you enter into the first turn from the cast position you must drive the hips down at the same time as the weight starts its downward descent to the low point in the back (In the center and behind the 9’ line) of the trig.  This is where the core stability is crucial...most athletes tend to break at the mid-section creating a pike position (legs high, butt out and chest pointing down) which causes the low point to drift pass the point of transfer, which leads us into the next main phase.

#2:  Once you achieved step #1 properly, you then need to take the force that you just generated by driving the hips down with the weight towards the low point and then transfer/counter your weight/mass from right to left creating a sprinting action. Do not initiate this sprint action by pulling the left arm down and away...this will only create a diving action to the left and will give you a false feeling of speed.  Keep the left arm back and closed as long as possible during the transfer phase. 

Timing is critical...you must time the low point and transfer at the same time, or otherwise you will be fighting the weight, which will make the weight feel heavy and the movement slow.   

Hope this helps.   

Ryan Vierra wrote: Speed to the trig: If you want speed to the trig you need to achieve two main things: #1. As you enter into the first turn from the cast position you must drive the hips down at the same time as the weight starts its downward descent to the low point in the back (In the center and behind the 9’ line) of the trig.  This is where the core stability is crucial...most athletes tend to break at the mid-section creating a pike position (legs high, butt out and chest pointing down) which causes the low point to drift pass the point of transfer, which leads us into the next main phase. #2:  Once you achieved step #1 properly, you then need to take the force that you just generated by driving the hips down with the weight towards the low point and then transfer/counter your weight/mass from right to left creating a sprinting action. Do not initiate this sprint action by pulling the left arm down and away...this will only create a diving action to the left and will give you a false feeling of speed.  Keep the left arm back and closed as long as possible during the transfer phase.  Timing is critical...you must time the low point and transfer at the same time, or otherwise you will be fighting the weight, which will make the weight feel heavy and the movement slow.

This is gold Ryan.....thanks

David - you know how to fix this....

"You've SEEN it before"....smeagol...

he's not tall enough to be Bourquie.

Great stuff RV that is the best description I have ever heard, now if I make my body do what you told it to.

This should be posted on the getting started page on how to throw for easy reference. Like a short how to section on the board.

Talk about freaks of nature!  Ryan holds the left side back better than any thrower i have ever seen including T&F throwing. 

This is just an observation after watching Ryan over the years.  He keeps a very relaxed left arm, and many times you will find him not only staying closed until the last possible moment, but his hip drive actually creates more separation because of his uncanny timing.  Here are a couple of tips:
         1. Keep your thumb in the 'up' position with your left elbow ever so slightly bent.  This will keep your arm relaxed and help you keep it at 90 degrees from the shoulder, the shoulders level, and help resist the urge to pull it to generate speed.
         2. For athletes having trouble driving the hips down and getting the timing of the descent of the weight and the drop, try this.  Start lower with your cast.  Eventually you will get the concept of the force generation and can evolve to the more dynamic "sinking" which will create more lift with the weights.
         3. I never had the numbers of Dodge or Vierra, but it did help me improve to think of the weight throws this way:
                Sink-Pivot-Lift; Sink-Pivot-Lift-Pull  or SPL-SPLP

Hope this helps!  Throw far!

to echo brock, more vidoes:

http://youtube.com/user/Kiltedthrower">

Okay, I'd like some clarification.  Perhaps this is the difference in body types in throwing (ex: Hadley vs Brock) but I've noticed a big difference in the way certain throwers end up after their first spin. 

I attended a throwing clinic with Mike Smith.  We spent a lot of time where we ended up with our left foot pointed (so to speak) toward the left side of the trig.  However, I've noticed that Hadley and Brock end up with their left foot facing (or closer to) the right side of the trig.

As someone who is struggling to get their WFD further (as we all are) is there a more right than wrong when it comes to this or is it different for everyone?

LarryBrock wrote: Josh how much do you weigh?

I typically sit around 199-205 at 5'8"

Good thread.  Lots of info...to bad I can't practice footwork in my cube....