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Rule of thumb for throws per session?

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Topic: Rule of thumb for throws per session?
Posted By: Greg York
Subject: Rule of thumb for throws per session?
Date Posted: 3/25/12 at 7:36am
What is a good rule of thumb for number of throws of a type in a session?

I have no throwing background, and my sporting history is more endurance than power - so I can't draw from past training or from "feel" with this stuff. I have found recommendations for reps for high school athletes for shot and discuss, but HG implements are a lot heavier, and I wonder if I'm doing too much.

So, for example: if you're going to throw the light hammer, can 45 throws in a session be counterproductive? I know my performance degrades around 30 ish. Right now I'm torn between needing reps and concern that my reps aren't premium reps..

Seems sensible that you begin to train your body for less than optimal performance by driving it to a point where it begins to compensate for being tired by engaging the wrong muscles/ movements.

Are there rules of thumb?



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Watch for falling rocks!



Replies:
Posted By: JamesBullock
Date Posted: 3/25/12 at 1:08pm
I am still very much a neophyte, but I personally stop my session when performance degrades. You can stop throwing the implement then and JUST do footwork drills, winds, release drills, spin drills, and so on. To much fatigue, technical breakdown, and even frustration is a good time to stop the session.

You will get far better responses than mine, but I hope this helps.




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www.warriorsciences.com


Posted By: Jim Glover
Date Posted: 3/25/12 at 2:11pm
I use a similar plan as James. I have a set number of throws, if I feel good I keep to the plan, if my throws degrade over 2 to 3 reps I stop early. I was told by a good friend not to train more than 2 throws per session. I'm a rank newb so take what I say with a grain of salt.

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"A single one of us can defeat your whole army. If you do not believe it, you may try, only please order your army to stop shooting with firearms." - Mameluke Chieftain Kurtbay


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/25/12 at 5:17pm
Here's a sample of my nonsense.
Saturday I took 48 total throws with LWFD.
Sunday I took 44 Light Hammer throws on the books, with another 5 off the books.

I see recommendations of 25 to 35 throws for high school kids per session.   


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: C. Smith
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 12:41am
Good lord.  I don't take that many throws in a SEASON. 

Is your 45th throw going as far as your 5th throw?  your 10th throw?  your 20th throw?


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Posted By: MAT$O
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 12:43am
Greg-

I like taking high volume amount of throws during the season and especially late season.  But I also will cover multiple events each day.  I try to do a stone, weight, hammer every throw session.  Then I do a height day.  

Ill take between 10-20 throws in each event total including warm ups and drills.  Quality of throws is important as well.  I do all of them about 80% so that they stay smooth and fast.  I can work on rhythm.  


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Posted By: Sean
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 12:57am
48 throws in a single session with the LW and I might as well cut my hand off.
 
When I practice, it's very dependant on the implement. Stone, I might do 15 total throws, including warmups. LW would be 10. HW would be like 5-6. I MIGHT take 30-35 throws total in a session, covering 3-5 events.
 
Granted, I kinda suck but still.


Posted By: Duncan McCallum
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 3:02am
80% throws FTW. You can do these all day and focus on technique.

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The man in the arena.


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 6:46am
Ok, thanks guys.   

As a self-coached internet-coached novice, "80%" and "good form" are problems for me.  

"Good form" is problematic because I don't know good form when I'm executing - I assume I've done something right when it goes farther.   

I don't know "80%" except as measured by distance because everything feels reduced in power. At 100% I inevitably munge something.  

However, I will measure 80% distance and learn to get there as effortlessly as possible.





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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 8:18am
Originally posted by C. Smith C. Smith wrote:

Good lord.  I don't take that many throws in a SEASON. 

Is your 45th throw going as far as your 5th throw?  your 10th throw?  your 20th throw?




Wimp.   First I'm lifting more... Now I'm throwing more...   

The funny thing is, in Wfd amd stone, the answer to your question is yes. Because of the way I progress through drills, each drill set gets progressively more distance, so I get continuous positive feedback, so I just keep going.

Hammer, though, made it clear that the quality of movement was degrading. I could see on video that I had gone stiff.

Hate to cut down on the drills because I'm right at the point where I'm learning just enough control that can feel the difference, but I think I have to. Twin 45s back to back is too much for me.

I see Alan using softballs and lighter weights for technique volume. I may give some of that a try.



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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 9:46am

Couple of things I am doing this season different from previous...

- Deliberately plan in my drills.  For stone it is standing feet forward, standing one foot back, standing with lean, etc.  I work drills till those feel 'good'...good is when they are smooth and distances are effortless.  If I am still putting in effort then still not there.  (Turns out to be about 5-6 of each drill)
 
- Fulls are all at about 80% like Duncan for now.  I want to be consistant.  That you are saying about munging stuff...it's cause you are not consistant.  How do I know?  Been there for over 4 seasons now, so FORCING myself to back off.  Hammer just frikken retaught me that lesson two weekends ago.  Throwing with Chad in KS and I TRIED..TO..THROW...results?  Hell I dropped 20' off my throw because my head wanted to all out it.  80% gets your form consistant.
 
- How to tell if you have good form, the throw is effortless.  I know that sounds Zen'ish, but it is true.  When the throw felt like nothing, and you see the distance is good to great...that is good form.  (WFD - good form has NO pulling in the hands cause orbits are smooth, Hammer - you stay solid over feet cause loose and orbit is smooth, Stone - it flows and you feel the power through the stone instead of falling off to side or over trig.)  Those are the things I am looking for as I am coached about 90% like you are.


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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: Duncan McCallum
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 2:29pm
Greg,

It's about positions. If you can't get into the right positions, all the power and speed in the world won't help. Sure, you will achieve some measure of success (physics and all that) but you'll never really break through into that next level. Now, I'm not saying deliberately try to throw 80 feet if your PR is 100; put a shame cone or something out at 80 feet and throw over it. Nice and easy. As Dave said, after enough time, it will feel effortless.

Then move the cone again.

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The man in the arena.


Posted By: s_hutch
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 3:03pm
Originally posted by Greg York Greg York wrote:

Originally posted by C. Smith C. Smith wrote:

Good lord.  I don't take that many throws in a SEASON. 

Is your 45th throw going as far as your 5th throw?  your 10th throw?  your 20th throw?




Wimp.   First I'm lifting more... Now I'm throwing more...   

The funny thing is, in Wfd amd stone, the answer to your question is yes. Because of the way I progress through drills, each drill set gets progressively more distance, so I get continuous positive feedback, so I just keep going.

Hammer, though, made it clear that the quality of movement was degrading. I could see on video that I had gone stiff.

Hate to cut down on the drills because I'm right at the point where I'm learning just enough control that can feel the difference, but I think I have to. Twin 45s back to back is too much for me.

I see Alan using softballs and lighter weights for technique volume. I may give some of that a try.


Are you calling your drills "throws?"  Or are your drills more like a certain percentage throw?  So you take like 50 or so drill-type throws in an event and another 50 drill-type throws in another event in a session?  If so, you could be throwing many of those "throws" at around 50% or something and that's why you're able to take that many reps.  If you were taking full 100% effort throws instead you likely wouldn't be able to take that many throws in a session.  Not saying you couldn't, just saying wearing out faster if you're not currently taking 100% throws all the time and then switch to that.  Forgive me if I'm getting what you're doing wrong, but that's what I'm getting from your posts.

I believe that if you're trying to drill to get that muscle memory down and work on some things it's definitely ok to take that many reps if you can handle it without letting quality diminish and you feel like you need it.  If you are taking certain percentage throws like 50 times like I'm thinking you are you could consider changing your throwing routine a bit by doing 50 or so drills without an implement in your hand, using the implement and not releasing it, working on one wind, one turn, etc.  Then you can switch to full throws and then you might get in something like 10 or 20 quality throws per event per session.  That way, you work on your things you want to work on and create muscle memory and then you get to apply it right after while doing a 100% throw. 


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:03pm
Originally posted by Duncan McCallum Duncan McCallum wrote:

Greg,

It's about positions. If you can't get into the right positions, all the power and speed in the world won't help. Sure, you will achieve some measure of success (physics and all that) but you'll never really break through into that next level. Now, I'm not saying deliberately try to throw 80 feet if your PR is 100; put a shame cone or something out at 80 feet and throw over it. Nice and easy. As Dave said, after enough time, it will feel effortless.

Then move the cone again.

Yeah, I'm trying to find the positions and the motion.    

Thing is, I only know what the throws look like when other people are doing them.  

I don't know what they feel like to do them.  So I crank up a camera, do the deed, measure the results, then watch my video, and try to figure out whether I did what I was trying to or not.  Can't tell you how often I think I'm doing something that I'm not.   Or think I'm not doing something I am.

Amusing how kinesthetically unware I can be.

I need the reps to find the positions and learn the feel, but doin' lots of them in a session may not be helping.   Just being impatient and greedy.   Need to chill and do the time.


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Duncan McCallum
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:22pm
Believe me man...I've been there. Hell I'm still there. Been throwing huge hammers (for me) and I watch my film and find ALL the things I did wrong or things I could do better.

It's a gradual process man...do the reps and you will get the payoff. The best advice I can give you: Leave your ego in the car. Being greedy and overestimating your capabilities yield little more than disappointment. Do what you can do. Study. Refine. Improve. Do more.

Set a goal. Mine isn't to win titles; I just want to improve by 5%.

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The man in the arena.


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:54pm
Originally posted by s_hutch s_hutch wrote:

Are you calling your drills "throws?"
 

Yeah, that's confusing.  Here, I'll try to clarify...

Anytime I hold and release a weight, I call it a throw.   It just so happens I do a lot of what I'd call throwing drills.   Standing throws.  Cast, turn and throw.  You get the picture.

Originally posted by s_hutch s_hutch wrote:

Or are your drills more like a certain percentage throw?  So you take like 50 or so drill-type throws in an event and another 50 drill-type throws in another event in a session?  If so, you could be throwing many of those "throws" at around 50% or something and that's why you're able to take that many reps.  

With the exception of the first throw in each drill, I throw hard enough to use distance to gauge comparative effectiveness.   That's not 100%, but it's about as hard as I can throw and mimick a motion.

Originally posted by s_hutch s_hutch wrote:

If you were taking full 100% effort throws instead you likely wouldn't be able to take that many throws in a session.  Not saying you couldn't, just saying wearing out faster if you're not currently taking 100% throws all the time and then switch to that.  Forgive me if I'm getting what you're doing wrong, but that's what I'm getting from your posts.
No prob.

Originally posted by s_hutch s_hutch wrote:

I believe that if you're trying to drill to get that muscle memory down and work on some things it's definitely ok to take that many reps if you can handle it without letting quality diminish and you feel like you need it.
There's the conundrum.   In those few cases where I think I've figured out a motion or a position, it is about muscle memory.

But, for the most part, it's trying to find and feel a motion or a position.  I watch the videos of others, then try to imitate it.   Often I think I'm doing something I not.   A movement that feels extreme to me is barely noticeable on video.   I create a lot of video, and do a lot of frame by frame comparisons to others so I can gauge whether I'm doing something.   Once I start getting close, that's when I focus on entraining a feeling into muscle memory.  Right now the reps are more about experimentation, finding the motion/position, and learning the feel.

Originally posted by s_hutch s_hutch wrote:

If you are taking certain percentage throws like 50 times like I'm thinking you are you could consider changing your throwing routine a bit by doing 50 or so drills without an implement in your hand, using the implement and not releasing it, working on one wind, one turn, etc.  Then you can switch to full throws and then you might get in something like 10 or 20 quality throws per event per session.  That way, you work on your things you want to work on and create muscle memory and then you get to apply it right after while doing a 100% throw. 
I can do this with stone.  The shot put people have lots of non-implement drills and ways to measure their effectiveness.   I do most of my stone work without implements right now because I'm working on launch, landing and pivot - all stuff I can do and gauge with a length of PVC.   Not so lucky with the HG events.


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 1:43am
Originally posted by Duncan McCallum Duncan McCallum wrote:

Then move the cone again.
 
LOLLOLLOL
 
I dont have a cone so for last three weeks it's been a domino's box that continued to lay around in the field I was using.  Have to laugh that you have similar approach.  Now some nosey busy body neighbor seems to have cleaned up that field, so I have to wait till the next bit of trash blows in.
 
Big smile


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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 1:53am
Originally posted by Greg York Greg York wrote:

With the exception of the first throw in each drill, I throw hard enough to use distance to gauge comparative effectiveness.   That's not 100%, but it's about as hard as I can throw and mimick a motion.
 
This right here is why you need the cone Dunc mentioned, or a pizza box.  You put that where your drills went last practice, work back to it on this practice.  Then move it for next drill.  My goal here (and hopefully someone that has tried this will speak up) is to reach that distance sooner in my drill warm ups.  So last week took me five warm ups to hit distance, then five at that distance.  When I can hit that during my warm up of the drill, hopefully I can move the cone of shame a bit.
 
And, this cone of shame distance should not be something you can hit once in a while.  For me it is a distance I can nail easy when my timing is right.  Drills are NOT for achieving distance, they are for consitency.  Sounds like you might need to refocus your thoughts a bit, you should not be trying to beat/crush your distances in drills.  Save that for your full throws...and also...
 
...I just had this thought....
 
...lol...
 
...you probably shouldn't be trying to crush your throws every session anyway.  I mean, do we lift trying to PR every time in the gym?  No, we lift 90% of the time to reinforce what we gained from last PR attempt, then we spent 10% of time going for PR.
 
Huh...there you go, I just had a THOUGHT!!!  Wink
 
(Now someone will try to shoot it down....Angry )


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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 3:10am
Gotcha.  Thanks y'all.   I'll work on reining in my horses for a bit.

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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Daniel McKim
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 4:01am
I think volume work has its benefits, but be careful.  I throw on "feel" more than anything anymore.  Do I still push it and chase that, "end on a good throw," monster that always seems to bite me back?  Sure, I do, but that's part of being competitive and wanting to perform at your very best.  

I spent years of over-throwing in track and it didn't help me one bit.  Now, I believe you can drill for long periods and that will pay HUGE dividends.  If you're going to do some high volume work, do it early in the season, but make sure they are ALL quality throws -- when you can't hit positions, can't concentrate, are super frustrated, or in pain, it's time to hang it up for the day and get after it another time. 

I also like to combine my sessions.  I used to isolate my throws into: day one stones and caber; day two weights and WOB; day three hammers and sheaf.  This didn't work that well since I'd have sometimes a week between throwing a stone or a weight or a hammer.  My practices are far more beneficial now when I structure them something like this:

1- Stones and WOB
2 - Light Weight and Hammers
3 - Heavy weight, sheaf and caber
4 - Stones and Light Hammer
5 - Heavy weight and WOB
6 - Stones and Light weight

*I think you get the idea.  I like to break my weights and hammers up so I'll do some form of the event an average of two sessions a week.  I sometimes like to break it up into a "light day" and a "heavy day."  This refers to the events I'd throw.  I'd take some form of combination of "light" or "heavy" events.  Light = stones, light weight, light hammer, sheaf.  Heavy = heavy weight, WOB, caber. I feel this also provides me opportunity to either work on a weak event or get some extra throws in an event that I'm currently struggling in.  Last April, May and into June my stones were really behind.  I spent extra time each week working on some things in these events to get the problem fixed.  In 2009 and years before, the weights were really my downfall, so 2010 was my year to really focus on the weights in hopes to bring those events up.  For a while, some of my other events were hampered by this, but I felt it was necessary to get the extra work in I needed for those events.  They're far from being a strength, as are any of my events.


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Posted By: rknebel
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 4:40am
I think this is one of those things that really depends on how your body responds to volume throwing.  I am a volume guy as well.  I have no idea what 80% is, besides tossing out a couple warm up throws I am balls to the wall the entire time.  But, I seem to respond well to that type of training.  I have had days where I would spend 2.5 hours just throwing 1-2 events.  Those days are few and far between because typically I can't throw 100% for 2.5 hours and still see progress in my throws.  I seem to make the most progress on the days where I can spend the most time throwing at a high level.  Once my throws or body stop responding the way I would like, I shut it down.
 


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/27/12 at 5:03pm
Thanks for weighing in everyone.

Your sportsmanship and support for beginners is one of the truly great things about this sport, this site, and the assembled inmates.

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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Silverback
Date Posted: 3/28/12 at 12:38am
You just got the scoop from the current world champion on this so I don't think I can add much.  But a key component in this is what you can do and need to do.  You have only so much you can do each week.  What do you need?  Is it time in the gym to get or be strong?  Well if your going to lift heavy and a lot then your not going to be able to throw a lot.  Or vice verse.  You only have so much gas in the tank.  Now if you are younger, eat well, take your supplements, say your prayers, sleep well, you can make the tank a little larger.  As you age, have stress, injuries, lack of sleep, don't eat right, your tank gets smaller.  Then in regard to the throws, what are you good at?  If you win the caber every single time, and stink in stone, you want to work on your stone hard to bring it up and do enough caber to keep it good.  And what do you like to do?  Doing things you like will be more productive.  If you like to throw 80% then do it and enjoy that and do a lot of volume.  Some like to dance closer to the edge and blast out each toss.  If your going out and throwing hard I don't know how you can do 20 throws and have anything on them?  A maximum effort can only be done a few times and your done for the day.  And then you have to recover.  And finally there is life.  Some people have kids, wives, jobs, all kinds of things that get in the way of just throwing first.  I get to toss on Saturday, so I do the events I can and need to work on then.  So my point is, while it is great to have Dan's blueprint, it is not your blueprint.  You have to take that and make it yours for what you need and work it into your life.  

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Mule

Sportkilt
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Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 3/31/12 at 5:53am
Thanks Myles. Maybe after a season I have a better feel for some of this. Right now there are endless things to learn and experiment with, and my curiosity and OCD are trying to kill me. You'd think after 51 years I'd learn something about the foolishness of my ways, but i'm afraid i can't provide any evidence of that!

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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 4/10/12 at 3:22am
Originally posted by Silverback Silverback wrote:

If you like to throw 80% then do it and enjoy that and do a lot of volume.  Some like to dance closer to the edge and blast out each toss.  If your going out and throwing hard I don't know how you can do 20 throws and have anything on them?  A maximum effort can only be done a few times and your done for the day.  
 
Ok, so I just realized something that my ego was doing opposite to what I was saying.  SIGH...of course.  I was still trying to throw full every time...and naturally my numbers would get shorter starting around throw #8 or so.
 
I need to ACTUALLY, FOR REAL...take my top numbers and multiply by .8.  That is where the cone of shame should go.
 
My thoughts knew that, but my ego kept putting my markers out 'oh here looks good' and that turned out to be maybe 5ft short of my longest hammer practice throws.  That's not 80% you idiot!
 
Ok, now that I have written this, now I am beholden to do just that next throws practice on Thurs.
 
Work on form and smooth...and that eighty will take my ego out of trying to blast for one more practice PR.  SIGH!!!!!!!!
 


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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 4/10/12 at 5:50am
Originally posted by dl_buffy dl_buffy wrote:

Originally posted by Silverback Silverback wrote:

If you like to throw 80% then do it and enjoy that and do a lot of volume.  Some like to dance closer to the edge and blast out each toss.  If your going out and throwing hard I don't know how you can do 20 throws and have anything on them?  A maximum effort can only be done a few times and your done for the day.  
 
Ok, so I just realized something that my ego was doing opposite to what I was saying.  SIGH...of course.  I was still trying to throw full every time...and naturally my numbers would get shorter starting around throw #8 or so.
 
I need to ACTUALLY, FOR REAL...take my top numbers and multiply by .8.  That is where the cone of shame should go.
 
My thoughts knew that, but my ego kept putting my markers out 'oh here looks good' and that turned out to be maybe 5ft short of my longest hammer practice throws.  That's not 80% you idiot!
 
Ok, now that I have written this, now I am beholden to do just that next throws practice on Thurs.
 
Work on form and smooth...and that eighty will take my ego out of trying to blast for one more practice PR.  SIGH!!!!!!!!
 

Vanity is ALWAYS getting in my way.   BUT - I managed to do this the past two weekends!   Not only did my form start looking better on video, but two of my long standing problems began working themselves out, and the distances are still satisfying.   I'm sold.   Hell, I may even try 70 and 60 percent.  LOL


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Borges
Date Posted: 5/08/12 at 9:56am
Prilepin's chart is a great guide. In any given workout, pick a level of effort and keep your volume around the total range for that level of effort.
 
Percent Reps/sets Optimal Total range
55–65 3–6 24 18–30
70–80 3–6 18 12–24
80–90 2–4 15 10–20
90+ 1–2 4 10




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Cheers,

Carlos



"Live free or die"


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 5/09/12 at 5:16am
Thanks for the chart.  I'm waaay overcooking it by this model.

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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Borges
Date Posted: 5/09/12 at 10:15am
 
I would add that my personal belief is that you do very little learning when you throw much above 80% effort. Full effort throws just try to mimic the patterns that you learn and perfect with reduced effort throws.


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Cheers,

Carlos



"Live free or die"


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 5/09/12 at 2:06pm
How do you gauge 80% in your sessions?   Do you set range targets?


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: JSiau10
Date Posted: 5/09/12 at 6:18pm
Greg all you have to do to gauge your 80% throws is come throw with me and land your throws only a couple feet past mine instead of way out there and you'll be good.

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I'm just an idiot, pretending to be smart.


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 5/10/12 at 1:47am
I've been doing it (right or wrong) based off of my practice PR's.  If I have a PR at 103 in practice, then I take 80% of that as the distance I should hit.  Usually I will throw a board or found piece of trash at that number so I cn see it.  (Been really consdering those little wire flags though.)

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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: Borges
Date Posted: 5/10/12 at 3:53am
Originally posted by dl_buffy dl_buffy wrote:

I've been doing it (right or wrong) based off of my practice PR's.  If I have a PR at 103 in practice, then I take 80% of that as the distance I should hit.  Usually I will throw a board or found piece of trash at that number so I cn see it.  (Been really consdering those little wire flags though.)
 
Similar to how I do it. I've been doing this a long time and I have a good SUBJECTIVE feel for what constitutes an 80% effort. I'll put a towel down at a range that I'm trying to work and use that as a gauge.  That towel isn't necessarily at 80% of my max distance.


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Cheers,

Carlos



"Live free or die"


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 5/10/12 at 1:06pm
Josh: Re: Way out there...
Before the next few years pass I bet this conversation gets turned around 180*.   You do your darnest to make that happen, I'll try like heck to prevent it, and we'll end up making both of us better before things get worse.   I'll try to hold you off until I'm 60.  You try to cut me down at 54 (3 years - try to make me eat this post.)

Borges: Re:"Not necessarily 80% of max distance".  
I'm wondering if you're suggesting the power:distance curve isn't linear.   I might throw 50 at full power, but throw 45 at 80%.   That's only a 10% increase in distance, but it might require a whole hell of a lot more effort.

I'm curious if you've seen my other question about drill progression multipliers?   I'm looking for methods of self diagnosing problem areas.  The shot gang has a lot of these metrics published so interested parties can see what "nominal" progressions look like when drills are compared.


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: Alan H
Date Posted: 5/17/12 at 4:30pm
I try to do three events in every workout and as often as not, i do four..  That said, I also tend to throw in cycles.  So for example, for about a month I get the open stone out at every throws session.  Recently, I've gotten LWFD out for every workout because I got sick of working so hard at Open Stone and making no progress.  The last month on LWFD has yielded a lot of progress so that's comforting.

45 throws in any event seems like a lot to me, even if half of them are drills.  Here's a typical workout breakdown for me, if I'm by myself for 2 1/2 hours.

warmup event.... This is where I'll do stuff like footwork with the softball, or "stick the hip" with the softball, or "throw the 5 pound iron bar"  or "chuck the old HS discus"...   stuff like that.  Give this about 10-15 minutes.  It's all about reinforcing one or two fundamental throwing principles,  like "get some separation and then drive the hip into the throw...".

Event 1 ... light weight or light stone

some warmup... then pick a drill and do it maybe 6-8x.  Then do 4-5 throws, working on ONE, or at most TWO things.   Then maybe 4-5 where I really try to blast it out there at about 95% effort. I rarely throw at an honest 100% effort, anything comparable to a 100% max effort deadlift because as you've said, if I do that, I mudge it up.

Event 2  ..... heavy weight or heavy stone

I'm already warmed up.  I may pick a drill or decide on the one thing I'm really going to focus on today.  I'll do that for 4-5-6 throws, then try to blast it out  at 95%   for 3-4 more.

event 3 .... likely as not, it's hammer.  I only own a 16 and a 12, no 22 hammer here.

I often will do 30-40 winds in sets of 6-8 without releasing, just getting into the feel of the rhythm, and catching the ball behind me.  Then I'll do 3-4 single spin and release, then 3-4 working on one particular thing, and then 3-4 blasting it out there.  So that's something like 9-12 actual throws.

Event 4 ..... usually caber but maybe wob

both of these events tire me out like no other so I'm only good for maybe 6-8 tosses.  So I think about ONE thing I'm going to do, and then do that about 3-4x. For the remainder, I try to put out 95% effort.

So how many total times do I grab some Highland implement and let it leave my hand at some velocity? This is not counting the softball or discus warmup.    Looks like about  40-45 throws, maybe 50 total over all four events in 2 1/2 hours.

Sometimes I have "theme" days.  Yesterday was a"theme" day.  The theme was -  "throw the goddamned thing over the stupid bar you wretched dork!"

I was throwing with a guy who'd never done sheaf before. He's young and strong and gullible, so I had him do three throws to my two.  ANY-way I did at least a dozen sheaf tosses with the 16, starting with a plain old relaxed "power clear" style and thing finishing up with about 4  where I stick my hip...a bit unorthodox, but it's working.

Then wob.  We put the bar at 13 and gave it a go, maybe 3-4 times each  He has 13 like it's no problem, I gotta work for it. So then we went to 13' 6"and gave that a shot 3-4 times. I hit the bar a bunch, he cleared it. So we went to 14'  and tried THAT.  I tried about 3x and said "enough". He did it about 4-5 times and then wanted to try 14' 6".  I just watched in disgust.

Then I set up a little challenge.  Put the bar a foot below your usual top-end and clear that AS FAST AS POSSIBLE... as in throw, pick up the weight IMMEDIATELY...swing and throw again.  Do it as many times as you can, to clear your height.    I got 12 feet, 3x, mudged up the fourth one and smacked it into the bar even though I still had plenty of gas.  The most I've ever done this is 6x in a row.   He got 13 feet 5x before he did and up-and-down in front of the bar.. 

That was a LOT of wob, but hey, it's "theme day".  Looks like about  14 wob throws over about a half-hour span.  That was after the sheaf workout.

then we went and did some HWFD and I KILLED it for about 6 tosses and said "enough for one day".

Hope that helps.

BTW, you are kicking ass.  I just want to remind you of that.  You haven't even thrown at your first Games yet, for Gods sake.


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Alan Hebert

Geezer-In-Training


Posted By: D. Haakenson
Date Posted: 5/18/12 at 5:30am
24


Posted By: dl_buffy
Date Posted: 5/18/12 at 6:33am
42, you got it wrong.

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I have very few social interaction skills, so I just throw stuff instead.


Posted By: Sammy68123
Date Posted: 5/19/12 at 3:51am
Originally posted by Alan H Alan H wrote:


Sometimes I have "theme" days.  Yesterday was a"theme" day.  The theme was -  "throw the goddamned thing over the stupid bar you wretched dork!"
 
You need a poster or T-shirt for that theme <LOL>!


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Teresa Merrick
Bellevue, NE


Posted By: BrandonMcElroy
Date Posted: 5/22/12 at 8:40am
As a newbie in this sport, I have seen talk of drills but don't really know what those are. All I've done up to this point is work on the throws. I may do standing vs full, one turn vs two turn and things like that but don't know of any specific drills like the "stick the hip" that was mentioned.

Is there anyone who has videos or descriptions of drills for any/all events?


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Brandon


Posted By: D. Van Skike
Date Posted: 7/08/12 at 2:38am
So this is where Greg and Glover hang out when they should be lifting. 


Posted By: Greg York
Date Posted: 7/09/12 at 4:41pm
You know me, Dave.  

If there's weight around to be lifted, I'll sneak away before anyone notices me.


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Watch for falling rocks!


Posted By: KRansom
Date Posted: 7/29/12 at 1:03pm
How often would you guys recommend throwing things? One session per week? Two? Three?


Posted By: D. Haakenson
Date Posted: 7/30/12 at 3:54pm
I would throw as many times per week as you can while still maintaining some kind of progression. Obviously this is going to be very personal; it is probably best to keep records of your best throws in each throwing session so that you can be aware of any trends - negative or positive - and adjust your throwing volume accordingly.



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