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MWC 2014 W40-49 is now split

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candysprinkles View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 7:07pm
Masters Women asked for a lighter weight than Open Women (21 v 28.) Just like Masters Men throw a lighter weight than Open/A/B Men (42 v 56.)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiltedGolfChick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 7:16pm
It's a start! I'm very happy for the change. Big smile
 
Now, to start training and saving...
~Gretchen
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wayne Pogany Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 7:31pm
Don is right on about the 35.....keep in mind that 20+ years ago "masters" was 50+.... then about 15 years ago it was dropped to 45...and a couple years later 40...here in New England we never had enough of us old farts to do the age group thing, so my efforts to keep it at 50+ brought me enough flack that it pretty much ended my interest in AD'ing..... I was asked a couple times to make a 35# to try some demos to foster some interest.....but my heart wasn't in it.....but back in the day, everybody under 50 threw the 56......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thegnome Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 7:34pm
I don't care what I throw, just let me know so I can get Landrich to make me one.
Andrew G

Vada a bordo CAZZO!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 17/20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 7:52pm
Wayne, long time brother hope your well. May see you in Ct this fall. Thanks for the clarification .
I MAY BE BIG , BUT I'M FAST
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Juli Peterson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Juli Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 8:09pm
Jay: But there are only some members from 1 class asking for a lower weight.

Fixed for youWink

(BTW-it was a pleasure briefly meeting you and your wife this past weekend. Sorry we missed your big party, volunteering took more out of me than I'd imagined. But I was still ready to throw the 28 the next day..;) 

jp


You have to stop doing that Juli, if it worked we'd all be doing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sammy68123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 9:16pm
I apologize for being late to the announcement, but I've had to work away from my computer all day without resources to comment.

I appreciate SMAI/MWC offering an accommodation. However, to be a bit of a wet blanket, the "compromise" from MWC is something, but no cigar yet. They threw us women a bone of separating the age groups in the 40-49 category, but still kept different weights for the two sections . . .

1) Yes, we have stupendous numbers of women for 2014 to allow for a split, but how about future years? What happens if only 2 enter the 45-49 class next year or future years? Will MWC keep them as a separate class throwing the 21#? It creates more problems than it solves.

2) It still maintains the double standard of weights for master's women throwers that doesn't exist for the men.

3) The dual-weight standard still represents a disconnect between MWC and the continually increasing number of master's women's competitions that are using the 21# at age 40, NOT 45 or 50.

The double standard of the weights has always been the issue among the women in favor of adopting the 21# weight for all age groups. The argument of "it's always been that way" is pretty weak justification: try telling the cop who pulls you over "I've always driven 50 in this 35 zone"--won't fly.
Teresa Merrick
Bellevue, NE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dWood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 10:29pm
Hey Wayne P,how is everything?

Quick question and just playing devils advocate if enough older master men complain about the 42 would you switch to the 35 ??

Before any woman slam me let me state that my wife threw as well as my 2 daughters and I tried to encourage woman in New England to compete/ throw when I was ADing- so Im all for woman sharing the field but it is the heavy events..we should keep it the way it has been and some people will say sports evolve/grow just don't think this is the right way. Just my humble .02 and yes it's a males view but ask Denise H,Lacy J,Jenna F,Kate G and they will tell you besides guys like Wayne Pogany,Wayne Hill,Bill Schmitt,Dana Florence,Eric Suave,and Leroy Mcdonl there weren't too many men pushing the games comitte to have the woman showcased like they should have with the top men
JUST BRING IT /

SPEED KILLS..BUT STRENGTH PUNISHES
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7/31/13 at 10:49pm
Kevin, can a 47yr old throw in the 40-44 class at the MWC? Is the 5 game rule hard and fast or is that just an arbitrary number that someone picked and is not adhered to. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 12:14am
Originally posted by bigirish01 bigirish01 wrote:

14# is 1 stone...not 1/2


You're right. Sorry about that - I used to know my stone weight conversions quite well back in the UK.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 12:16am
Originally posted by Juli Peterson Juli Peterson wrote:

Jay: <span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">But there are only some members from 1 class asking for a lower weight.</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">Fixed for youWink</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">(BTW-it was a pleasure briefly meeting you and your wife this past weekend. Sorry we missed your big party, volunteering took more out of me than I'd imagined. But I was still ready to throw the 28 the next day..;) </span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">jp</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>



Juli, I was sorry you weren't able to come to my and Bret's house for the Clawbeque as well. Maybe next year!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 3:43am
  Carlos,  women's hammers ring a bell, about 10 -12 yrs ago. Would you care to enlighten everyone on that. My memory is fading but I think it had to do with changing the weight of the hammer heads > and the length of the handles from 50" to 48".  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Juli Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 5:59am
Originally posted by candysprinkles candysprinkles wrote:

Originally posted by Juli Peterson Juli Peterson wrote:

Jay: <span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">But there are only some members from 1 class asking for a lower weight.</span>
>(BTW-it was a pleasure briefly meeting you and your wife this past weekend. Sorry we missed your big party, volunteering took more out of me than I'd imagined. But I was still ready to throw the 28 the next day..;) </span>



Juli, I was sorry you weren't able to come to my and Bret's house for the Clawbeque as well. Maybe next year!

Thank you! I heard it was a ton of fun. If I'm fortunate enough to be invited back, I'll have to relook at volunteering all day prior to throwing and hopefully find another way to contribute. Then I'll have the energy for fun! Smile

jp
You have to stop doing that Juli, if it worked we'd all be doing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote K Rogers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 6:16am
Kel-

The 5 game rule is still in place and I can say with pretty good confidence that I can recognize the region and the competition level of most people when they list their 5 games. The European Championships and the few other locals that I've not personally experienced have been a learning experience .. but just imagine .. List your 5 games as if you were making an application.

.. then sit back and look at that list. I would recognize each and every one of them and you would start with Pleasanton.

I was skeptical at first but with some experience you can know an athletes circle of influence in their choice of the games they list.

Is it a fool proof system of demonstrable qualification for Worlds .. no.

-K
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote K Rogers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 6:29am
Kel-

And I don't want to confuse the age qualifications for age groups any further. There are age group limits. I've been reluctant to do the photo ID check at registration like weightlifting meets because I trust people to sign up for the correct age group at our MWCs. If they can't do that by themselves, then I'm at a loss.

Everyone is a mature adult in this meet and we have to expect some issues but the age group shouldn't be one of them. Its not been the difficult part so far.  

-K


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigirish01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 8:34am
Originally posted by Juli Peterson Juli Peterson wrote:

Jay: But there are only some members from 1 class asking for a lower weight.

Fixed for youWink

(BTW-it was a pleasure briefly meeting you and your wife this past weekend. Sorry we missed your big party, volunteering took more out of me than I'd imagined. But I was still ready to throw the 28 the next day..;) 

jp


Thank you Juli! I enjoyed meeting you as well! And I know that there are probably quite a few women to include my wife who will be a Master next year who really dont care one way or the other about changing the weight.... They just want to throw. This whole scenario saddens me abit. Because essentially the MWC was bullied into a change.
Jay "Big Daddy" O'Neill
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigirish01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 8:36am
Originally posted by candysprinkles candysprinkles wrote:

Originally posted by bigirish01 bigirish01 wrote:

14# is 1 stone...not 1/2


You're right. Sorry about that - I used to know my stone weight conversions quite well back in the UK.
Yeah I know I am
Jay "Big Daddy" O'Neill
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote K Rogers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 9:57am
C'mon Jay-
 
Let's move on .. nobody was bullied .. we agreed to a change.
 
I'm still not convinced that there's anything we've done in the MWC that is unfair to women, including the decision in 2003 to go with the 28lb weight for the contest. It was my decision that day as AD and I don't back down from it. We were hosting the first women's group at MWC Springfield and I went with what was my best idea -the 28lb. Records were set with it .. apparently that's more important to me than to others but I can live with it. We can change if we have to, I guess.
 
I listened to the comments and we found a reasonable compromise. Please don't call it being bullied. That just keeps making it feel like a fight .. and its already caused enough of the dissolution of comradery.
 
-K 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigirish01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 11:12am
Ok Kevin... with respect to you, I wont say the MWC was bullied....  But that was one fast turn around. Im Done with this as well.
Jay "Big Daddy" O'Neill
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigirish01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 2:31pm
Originally posted by candysprinkles candysprinkles wrote:

Originally posted by Juli Peterson Juli Peterson wrote:

Jay: <span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">But there are only some members from 1 class asking for a lower weight.</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">Fixed for youWink</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">(BTW-it was a pleasure briefly meeting you and your wife this past weekend. Sorry we missed your big party, volunteering took more out of me than I'd imagined. But I was still ready to throw the 28 the next day..;) </span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">jp</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>



Juli, I was sorry you weren't able to come to my and Bret's house for the Clawbeque as well. Maybe next year!


Good thing you pointed out that the BBQ was at your house....
Jay "Big Daddy" O'Neill
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 2:46pm
I like clarity Jay. And I'm a big fan of equality. Obviously.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote rogerws76 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 3:30pm
I can see the ghost of Dinnie now ... hauntingly taunting Candy Sprinkles:

"I canna help but ask ... have ye misplaced yer whiteboard again, lassie?"  

:)  Ha!

Give 'em hell, Candy!!!  Tongue
Roger
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 3:43pm
I'll stomp ol' Dinnie with my boots Roger, LOL!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Juli Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 3:53pm

[/QUOTE]

Juli, I was sorry you weren't able to come to my and Bret's house for the Clawbeque as well. Maybe next year![/QUOTE]

Good thing you pointed out that the BBQ was at your house.... [/QUOTE]

Angie had mentioned where it was, I just didn't make the sprinkle connectionWink. I'd be thrilled to make it next year.

As we've all set this aside and moved on, and since Roger is kind enough to allow me to throw with the young whipper snappers and the heavier weights, I have one thought to leave this with. I don't mean any disrespect, believe me.

For the women who want a lighter HWD because you are now older. Were you throwing the 28# over 30' or so when you were younger and have now found that your age prevents you from doing this which makes a 21# more realistic? Or has it always been too heavy to throw? If it's been too heavy all along, respectfully speaking, in a Heavy Athletics sport...well, hmmmm. The only thing that still sits in my brain is, is this an age issue or a strength issue? 

Again, no disrespect. People have seemed to achieve a happy compromise and I don't wish to muddy Kevin's desk any further. It's just a nagging thought on my part. Moving on...
You have to stop doing that Juli, if it worked we'd all be doing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote candysprinkles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 5:54pm
I supported the change to a 21# for Master Women mostly because that is what the majority of the games in the PNW (with the exception of Enumclaw) have been using for the 2012 and 2013 seasons. I think we even used it a couple games in 2011. Several more seasoned athletes (meaning they have been throwing far longer than me) started championing the 21 a few years ago and it has been readily adopted by the majority of the ADs at PNW games. I like to throw what I usually compete and train with.

Did I ever personally throw the 28# over or even near to 30'? In my dreams! I don't come from a strength sport or throwing background. I came into HG because my husband started throwing and I saw how much fun he was having with the other throwers. I was also encouraged to try it out from the women throwers that I had gotten to know (much much fewer than now, even though it's only been a couple years.) It has been a blast, even though I am in the bottom half of the field. I don't think that you need to be a top thrower to part of this sport. And hey, if one person looks at me throwing and having fun and says to themselves "Heck, if Candy Sprinkles can throw that heavy shit, I probably could too!" and joins our merry band of misfits, that helps our sport grow and that is a win in my book. So, to me there is much more to being a thrower than being "the best." I am trying to be "my best."

I am working on getting stronger, since this is a strength sport, and I always enjoy bettering my own numbers. I will never be a huge numbers thrower, my body type and age are working against me in that. I just try to get better each games, each season. And that has been working well for me.

Now, on to another possibly controversial subject for MWC 2014. SHEAF! I appeal to the powers that be to add it to the competition - I really want to bring my special "Candy" fork to Scotland!

(Kevin Rogers, I am totally kidding, unless maybe there is a glimmer of hope?)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wsciscoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 7:47pm
Throwers should throw in their class period if they can choose what age class they want to throw in what is the purpose of having divided age classes? The entire thing has become confusing. Throw where you are told and what you are told. This should be black and white and easy to follow Kevin says A B C we do A B C nobody doing whatever they please, do what you are told to do. Whatever happened to respecting your AD?
Old enough to know better. Still too young to care.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Juli Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 8:07pm
Is that at me Glenn? Have I been disrespectful? I simply asked if it were possible and was told yes. If Kevin believes that I've disrespectful to him I expect to hear about it, because we're adults here. I don't know that anyone is doing what they please. Many women are throwing the weights they've requested to throw, certainly I'm no different. Unless I'm missing a key ingredient here. Could be, I've missed things before.

But if you're coming at me, well then, that's certainly a disappointment. 

jp
You have to stop doing that Juli, if it worked we'd all be doing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wsciscoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 8:29pm
Kevin has enough problems organizing this event Without people wanting to jump from class to class That just adds more confusion. whichever woman throws the 21 pound heavy weight for distance the farthest will have the record. So in this situation no one needs to jump class to set a record just beat the people in your class.
Just my 2 cents kevin has the final say and I respect him
Old enough to know better. Still too young to care.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Juli Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 8:34pm
Ok, that said, plus Anita's comments on the FB and I am just so hurt and shocked that you two are coming at me like this.

I'm strong enough to throw the 28 and would like a chance to do so on the world stage. That's all. I'm so sorry that it has affected you both so horribly as to ruin a field friendship that I was pleased with. Best of luck to you both.  

jp
You have to stop doing that Juli, if it worked we'd all be doing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sammy68123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 8/01/13 at 9:23pm
[QUOTE=Juli Peterson] For the women who want a lighter HWD because you are now older. Were you throwing the 28# over 30' or so when you were younger and have now found that your age prevents you from doing this which makes a 21# more realistic? Or has it always been too heavy to throw? If it's been too heavy all along, respectfully speaking, in a Heavy Athletics sport...well, hmmmm. The only thing that still sits in my brain is, is this an age issue or a strength issue? [QUOTE]

Hi Julie,

I started HG in 2007 just before turning 50 and have thrown as B class with 28#. My best ever in 7 seasons with a 28# has been 24'. As a fitness trainer, I'm always about getting strong and stronger (I've competed in PL at national and international levels). I'm not really worried about rankings or similar. But at a games with open competition (no A/B split) where some superb younger women (half your age) who used to be top-level collegiate throwers leave you in last place in every event, sometimes you yearn to compete only with your age peers, even if they outthrow you by a whole bunch too.

So I guess to answer your question, it's a bit of both. I haven't shied away from the 28#, but I can be more selective about the games I attend. I have some chronic joint issues as well and I want to keep throwing as long as I can. If sticking to games where I can throw the 21# is one of the tickets, I'll do it. My time, travel funds, and other commitments in life let me set that priority.

I hope this has answered your question from at least one of your readers.
Teresa Merrick
Bellevue, NE
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