Throwing distances to power levels

stormer wrote: So how much power is required to throw a specific distance for average athleticism .. Light stone 45ft light weight 70ft light hammer 120ft wfh 14ft 275 power clean 300 bench 260 push press 400 squat 200 power snatch dead lift 485

stormer wrote: So how much power is required to throw a specific distance for average athleticism .. Light stone 45ft light weight 70ft light hammer 120ft wfh 14ft 275 power clean 300 bench 260 push press 400 squat 200 power snatch dead lift 485

I think it's been a long time since you guys were at those strength levels....

Hey Jake, Jon must've not mentioned his 407 power clean from his college days that he told me about in PHX!  Might be something there.

eclarkhb wrote: 300# bench & 400# squat? That's decidedly below average for any strength-related competitor (strongman, Highland Games, whatever...)

I am decidedly below average. 



I shall have to rely on finesse and treachery.

Tom

TomLawrence wrote: and treachery.

jsully wrote: TomLawrence wrote: and treachery.   this is key, imo.   "watch out for that back-line"   "careful, the hammer almost hit the ground"   "man, you're lucky the judge didn't see that one"   "careful you don't pull too early, it'll come out the front"       carry on.

This is always an interesting subject.  Obviously technique of some sort has to be there to throw really far or high.  All the top guys I've been around make their technique around what there strong at.  Stormer, the numbers you put out there are about right on, in my opinion.  The question is how do you throw further.  I would say that you have to get to certain strength levels to be able to get in the right positions, to execute great technique.  You can watch youtube videos and try to hit proper technique but it will be nearly impossible to hit without tremendous strength between your chest and knees.  That is why Matt Vincent and Dan McKim are so dominant right now.  Matt is the strongest guy overall in the middle of his body and he is able to turn and sprint in the stone, hold positions in the weights and sprint,  and two wind big hammers.  Dan's hammers and weights started being elite when he concentrated on back squatting and front squatting consistently with good weights.  I really believe if he didn't start doing that he wouldn't be throwing what he is.

It really is and Sean is spot on, as usual.

stormer wrote: Sean Betz wrote: This is always an interesting subject.  Obviously technique of some sort has to be there to throw really far or high.  All the top guys I've been around make their technique around what there strong at.  Stormer, the numbers you put out there are about right on, in my opinion.  The question is how do you throw further.  I would say that you have to get to certain strength levels to be able to get in the right positions, to execute great technique.  You can watch youtube videos and try to hit proper technique but it will be nearly impossible to hit without tremendous strength between your chest and knees.  That is why Matt Vincent and Dan McKim are so dominant right now.  Matt is the strongest guy overall in the middle of his body and he is able to turn and sprint in the stone, hold positions in the weights and sprint,  and two wind big hammers.  Dan's hammers and weights started being elite when he concentrated on back squatting and front squatting consistently with good weights.  I really believe if he didn't start doing that he wouldn't be throwing what he is.   The two best technicians I've competed with are Ryan Vierra and Larry Brock.  They threw good when they were not at their strongest, but threw much better when they were real strong.  Don't let them fool you.  Ryan V. is an extremely stong thrower that wouldn't talk about how strong he was.  I bet he could of walked in the gym and squatted 600 and push pressed 400 like nothing.  In 2005 when he was at his strongest that I've seen, he came out throwing 91 and 49 in the weights, 145 and 119 in the hammers at 37 years old.    Larry Brock was much the same.  He isn't as strong as Ryan, but when he consistently squatted and pulled twice a week he hit huge throwing numbers on a weekly basis.  Watch Larry's heavy hammer throw from 2008 Worlds.  He gets tremendous push and pull from his lower body and hits great positions.  He can't do that when he isn't strong.    To be great at the games you need to persistenly work hard on both technique and strength.  I would say strength will be more important the bigger games you do and the older you get. Yeah good post Sean, for the record I was not talking about the elite but the mere mortals which is about 97% of the throwers out there, as for throwers not hitting the numbers I listed above and are way stronger , hang your kilts up fast!!!'LOL

Hey man i"m definitely a mere mortal.  We are all just trying to do better.  At the Arnold I threw 71 feet in the 28.  2 days ago I 1 turned 75+ after a couple throws without much trouble.  The difference was about 25% gain in strength back after an illness.  It can come and go anytime.

Sean Betz wrote: stormer wrote: Sean Betz wrote: This is always an interesting subject.  Obviously technique of some sort has to be there to throw really far or high.  All the top guys I've been around make their technique around what there strong at.  Stormer, the numbers you put out there are about right on, in my opinion.  The question is how do you throw further.  I would say that you have to get to certain strength levels to be able to get in the right positions, to execute great technique.  You can watch youtube videos and try to hit proper technique but it will be nearly impossible to hit without tremendous strength between your chest and knees.  That is why Matt Vincent and Dan McKim are so dominant right now.  Matt is the strongest guy overall in the middle of his body and he is able to turn and sprint in the stone, hold positions in the weights and sprint,  and two wind big hammers.  Dan's hammers and weights started being elite when he concentrated on back squatting and front squatting consistently with good weights.  I really believe if he didn't start doing that he wouldn't be throwing what he is.   The two best technicians I've competed with are Ryan Vierra and Larry Brock.  They threw good when they were not at their strongest, but threw much better when they were real strong.  Don't let them fool you.  Ryan V. is an extremely stong thrower that wouldn't talk about how strong he was.  I bet he could of walked in the gym and squatted 600 and push pressed 400 like nothing.  In 2005 when he was at his strongest that I've seen, he came out throwing 91 and 49 in the weights, 145 and 119 in the hammers at 37 years old.    Larry Brock was much the same.  He isn't as strong as Ryan, but when he consistently squatted and pulled twice a week he hit huge throwing numbers on a weekly basis.  Watch Larry's heavy hammer throw from 2008 Worlds.  He gets tremendous push and pull from his lower body and hits great positions.  He can't do that when he isn't strong.    To be great at the games you need to persistenly work hard on both technique and strength.  I would say strength will be more important the bigger games you do and the older you get. Yeah good post Sean, for the record I was not talking about the elite but the mere mortals which is about 97% of the throwers out there, as for throwers not hitting the numbers I listed above and are way stronger , hang your kilts up fast!!!'LOL Hey man i"m definitely a mere mortal.  We are all just trying to do better.  At the Arnold I threw 71 feet in the 28.  2 days ago I 1 turned 75+ after a couple throws without much trouble.  The difference was about 25% gain in strength back after an illness.  It can come and go anytime.

Yeah Sean if mortal is light weigh over 90 light hammer 150 and put 56 then you sure are, appreciate your recovering from illness but your 75 In light weight is my Pr and you have another 10 to 15 that will come through!! Think your 400 hang clean will bring your numbers up fast.. Heal up fast and give dan and mat something to think about it..

This is the puzzle that I love about throwing.  Finding how to push all three important factors Strength, Speed, and Technique.  You need all three to keep improving, but if you focus on one too long you will another.  

Ah, a topic near and dear to my wimpy malnourished heart. Once again, my brother Sean speaks hard-earned wisdom - it's the strength between the chest and the knees that makes you throw far. Lifting heavy weights will help, but to get throwing strong you need to throw, a lot!

I long for the day that I have the technique to use what paltry strength I have. If it were only so simple as to need to put 50 pounds on my overhead lifts and 100 on my squat and dead.