Only some little dude wrote or came up with some kidney protien scare story.  You must eat big to be big, so quit counting and eat more. 

If you want to look like a cow, eat like a cow.  If you want to look like a carnivore, eat like a carnivore...or just eat the cow!

Protein with every meal, protein supplements between meals if you're trying to put on mass.

And milk. Lots of milk.

author unknown and me
First off, and far most you need to learn how your body response to protein and how their metabolism works.. Bascially, you have to learn this just like you learn what works best for you in the Gym.

         I persoanlly like a high protein diet and I try to take in around 1.5-2.5 grams of protein per body weight. It seem my body doesn't react to carbs very well so I try to stay away from them.. The primary function of carbohydrates is to provide energy for the body, especially the brain and the nervous system. Your liver breaks down carbohydrates into glucose (blood sugar), which is used for energy by the body. Dont get me wrong I still needs carbs to train and compete in the highland games but that is a different essay. I eat very few simple sugars and mostly complex carbs and I stop those intakes around 5-6pm. am a firm beilever in jumpstarting your body in the morning and COTTAGE CHEESE or YOGURT will jump start you metabolism and I eat for function. That is protein first, carbs second, veggies last.

Try not to mix fats or carbs the only time you should mix simple sugars and proteins are in pre and post work out or during a competition.   A lot depends on the absorbability of the protein itself which is influenced by its type. Any one remember P.E.R. or the Protein Efficiency Ratio. This was before Whey Protein, design protein and it was used to sell egg and milk proteins commercially.
Things like Eggs and fish are more complete protein and absorbed better than ground beef and pork, chicken and turkey are better absorbed than soy and milk proteins etc.

I ususally eat 1.5 -2.5 grams of protein per body weight which would be around (450-600) grams of protein a day without blinking over 3-4 solid meals and 3-5 shakes that includes daily pre and post and night time shakes. this includes setting my alarm at 2am to drink a Protein shake. call me crazy.

Sometimes, I will drink pasteurized egg whites as a meal replacement which is 50 grams per pop. My protein shakes are ALL CUSTOM blend designed by me. which I will goto http://proteinfactory.com/store/index.php     www.eggwhitesint.com   and www.supplementkings.com they will either desin something for you or you make your own. If you do go there let me know.. They are one of my sponser for my website (s)

    Eating protein first in a meal increases the efficiency of digestion and a greater overall amount of protein as an end result in from a meal. In short a greater amount of aminos make it to the blood stream. I call it eating for function...the function of the digestive system. I eat proteins first for 2 reasons-that digestive system is physiologically (enzymatically) geared that way and it improves the efficiency of digestion and a greater overall availability of proteins/aminos from food for the body to use.

Carbohydrates are digested 30% in the mouth with the salivary enzyme amylase and with of course chewing aiding the cause.
CARBS aren't digested in the stomach=they just sit there and slowly pass into the small intestines where the pancreatic enzymes do 70% more and complete the process. Fats are the same way if eaten first or mixed with carbs will sit there and clog up digestion.

Proteins are primarily digested in the stomach. Therefore, eating proteins after these foods will result in a reduced amount of protein digestion-leaving some incompletely digested and unabsorbable and therefore lost.
This in turn causes the undigested protein to be pulled into the small intestine reducing the protein efficiency of your meal and contributing to the mass of your colon.

You want something worse? We are set up by traditional eating to fail.
Go out to a steak house. First thing you get is your salad-THAT is the last thing you want to eat in a meal after the steak and then the potato.
Cellulose is undigestable by the human body and will really clog up the process reducing the efficiency of digestion and your meal itself.

As mentioned previously proteins speed up the metabolic rate more than carbs and fat. Concerning basal metabolism proteins speed it up 30%, Carbs and fats 10%. The mere process of digestion and absorption of protein races the metabolism and will increase anabolism in an advanced athlete.

Now granted you can eat a huge meal like a McDonald's Combo meal mix it all up and it will get digested but it will interfere with feedings and the efficiency of the meal will be less and eventually lead to a lot of adipose tissue gain.

There are reasons we eat Protein and Fat together and protein and carbs. Insulin. Eating fat and carbs are a death warrant to bb'ers when consumed together and lays adipose tissue down as easily as Home Depot lays down cheap carpet.

I could write more especially on the types of proteins and their absorption-things like incomplete proteins etc.

Anyhow. Just my 2 cents. We are all here to learn from each other but Dante's methods are backed by science and 3-4 years of online "University" studies with 100's reaping the benefits-so it is good advice and gospel for most ADVANCED lifters.

Protein will serve you a dual role in body modification in that it is as important for body fat reduction as it is for muscular gains. In regards to body fat reduction, protein has a specific dynamic action on the metabolism which means that when you ingest protein, your metabolic rate is elevated higher and remains elevated longer than when you ingest either fats or carbohydrates. A high carb meal will only elevate your metabolism from 4 to 30 percent above normal. This small elevation will last only 2 to 5 hours. A high protein meal however will elevate your metabolism by up to 70 percent above normal and this effect can last as long as 10 to 12 hours."




Edited by Snider

Day #1

 

6:00-6:30 Meal #1	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
2/3 cp Oatmeal	144	26	30	200
4 Eggs	16	96	162	274
8oz. Milk (skim)	52	32	0	84
				Meal Tot.--684
9:00 Meal #2
2 slices bread	96	24	0	120
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Fat free Mayo	10	0	0	10
				Meal Tot. 276
11:00 Meal #3
2 slices bread	96	24	0	120
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Fat free Mayo	10	0	0	10
				Meal Tot. 276
1:00 Meal #4
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Protein Shake	16	92	18	126
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
				Meal Tot. 356
3:30-4:00 Meal # 5
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
1.5 cups Cott. cheese	60	168	13.5	241.5
				Meal Tot. 380.5
8:00 PWO meal
Protein Shake	16	92	18	126
8:30-9:00 Meal #7
½ cp. Rice (brown)	132	16	9	157
10 oz chicken	0	220	22.5	242.5
Milk (16 oz)	104	64	0	168
Broc.	-	-	-	-
				Tot. 567.5
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	824	1500	342	2666
Percentages	31%	56%	13%
Day #2
Meal #1 6:00-6:30
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
2/3 cp Oatmeal	144	26	30	200
3 Eggs	12	72	121.5	205.5
8oz. Milk (skim)	52	32	0	84
				Meal Tot.615.5
Meal #2 9:00
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
1.5 cups Cott. cheese	60	168	13.5	241.5
				Meal Tot.380.5
Meal #3 11:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
				Meal Tot. 230
Meal #4 1:00
8oz. Chicken	-	176	18	194
Broc.	-	-	-	-
½ cp. Rice (brown)	132	16	9	157
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 477
Meal #5 4:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
				Meal Tot. 146
Meal #6 8:00
PWO Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 126
Meal #7 8:30-9:00
8oz. Chicken	-	176	18	194
Broc.	-	-	-	-
8oz. Milk (skim)	52	32	0	84
				Meal Tot. 278
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	556	1396	301	2253
Percentages	25%	62%	13%
Days 3 & 4
Meal #1 6-6:30
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
3 eggs	12	72	121.5	205.5
8oz. Milk (skim)	52	32	0	84
				Meal Tot.515.5
Meal #2 10:00
2 slices bread	96	24	0	120
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Fat free Mayo	10	0	0	10
				Meal Tot. 276
Meal #3 1:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot.356
Meal #4 4:00
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
1.5 cups Cott. cheese	60	168	13.5	241.5
				Meal Tot.380.5
Meal #5 8:00
PWO Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 126
Meal #6
¼ cp rice (brown)	66	8	4.5	78.5
7oz chicken	0	154	16	170
Broc.	-	-	-	-
				Meal Tot.248.5
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	472	1196	252.5	1902
Percentages	25%	61%	14%

cutting diet without diary, RICE or BREAD

Day #1

 

6:00-6:30 Meal #1	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
2/3 cp Oatmeal	144	26	30	200
4 Eggs	16	96	162	274
				Meal Tot.--600
9:00 Meal #2
7oz. Chicken	0	132	14	170
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
				Meal Tot. 270
11:00 Meal #3
7oz. Chicken	0	132	14	170
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
				Meal Tot. 396
1:00 Meal #4
8oz. Chicken	0	176	18	194
Protein Shake	16	92	18	126
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
2/3 cp Oatmeal	144	26	30	200
				Meal Tot. 604
3:30-4:00 Meal # 5
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
4 Eggs	16	96	162	274
				Meal Tot. 413
8:00 PWO meal
Protein Shake	16	92	18	126
8:30-9:00 Meal #7
10 oz chicken	0	220	22.5	242.5
Broc.	-	-	-	-
				MealTot. 242.5
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	584	1500	567.5	2651.5
Percentages	22%	57%	21%
Day #2
Meal #1 6:00-6:30
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
2/3 cp Oatmeal	144	26	30	200
3 Eggs	12	72	121.5	205.5
				Meal Tot.531.5
Meal #2 9:00
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
4 Eggs	16	96	162	274
				Meal Tot. 413
Meal #3 11:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
				Meal Tot. 230
Meal #4 1:00
8oz. Chicken	-	176	18	194
Broc.	-	-	-	-
½ cup oatmeal	108	20	22.5	150.5
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 470.5
Meal #5 4:00
7oz. Chicken	0	154	16	170
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 296
Meal #6 8:00
PWO Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 126
Meal #7 8:30-9:00
8oz. Chicken	-	176	18	194
Broc.	-	-	-	-
				Meal Tot. 194
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	400	1378	483	2261
Percentages	18%	61%	21%
Days 3 & 4
Meal #1 6-6:30
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
3 eggs	12	72	121.5	205.5
				Meal Tot.431.5
Meal #2 10:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
				Meal Tot. 246
Meal #3 1:00
6oz. Chicken	0	132	14	146
Yogurt	56	28	0	84
Prot. Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot.356
Meal #4 4:00
Can tuna	0	130	9	139
4 Eggs	16	96	162	274
1/3 cp. Oatmeal	72	13	15	100
				Meal Tot. 513
Meal #5 8:00
PWO Shake	16	92	18	126
				Meal Tot. 126
Meal #6
10oz chicken	0	220	22.5	242.5
Broc.	-	-	-	-
				Meal Tot.242.5
Day totals	Carb Calories	Prot. Calories	Fat Calories	Totals
	364	1125	442	1915
Percentages	19%	59%	22%

There were some really flawed studies on protein consumption back in the 50's that indicated that people couldn't metabolize more than X grams per sitting (35, maybe?), but there are many, many more studies that show that there is no particular limit to how much one can handle.  If you consume much more than you need, your body metabolizes the excess like carbohydrates (i.e., treats it like expensive bread).  There should be no concern about the effects of protein consumption on the kidneys for someone without kidney disease.

If you want the straight scoop (so to speak) on protein consumption for athletes, do a PubMed search for work by Lemon, who is arguably the world's expert.  He suggests numbers like 0.7 - 1 g/lb of bodyweight.

-Wayne

Brent,

You bring up a good point.  These people cry, "Protein is bad on your kidneys!".  What the hell do you think all of the extra fat you're carrying around is doing to you.  I'm sick of people coming up with reasons to not change. 

Tim

P.S.  I found a sign for those type of people...

 

LMAO 

In my opinion - those numbers are overkill unless you are a body builder training 3 hours everyday.

eating all of it is the easy part. Try cooking all of it.

even worse, trying buying all that meat. For the average thrower, that would be like 20 chicken breasts a day.

gram per pound seems like the most reasonable...and that's still a pain in the ass.

 Practice better technique.

As an athlete you need carbs.  If you're just trying to look pretty you can go quite low but since we need to perform you have to have some energy.  For the most part people/athletes take in way to many carbs (thereby eating less protein) and the carbs they do eat are crap.  Oatmeal, fruit, yams, beans and veggies are all good.  If you wanted to try to stay pretty while competing then ingest a helping of each of these foods in this order over the course of the day (or only consume them around the time you workout).  Oatmeal w/fruit and some protein for breakfast, a yam with some protein for lunch, and a salad with the beans and some protein for supper.  That's not even counting the quality snacks you can throw in between meals.

Oh and for those fat people that take up the handicap space that my grandmother needs I've got a sign for them too...  I call these people "Fatty Capped".

Umm... wouldnt any of the rest of you starve on those diets that Snider
posted up? 2000 calories a day is not going to cut it for me. Am I
missing something?

From an article on Basal metabolism:

...According to exercise physiologists William McArdle and Frank Katch,
the average maintenance level for women in the United States is
2000-2100 calories per day and the average for men is 2700-2900 per
day. These are only averages; caloric expenditure can vary widely and is
much higher for athletes or extremely active individuals. Some triathletes
and ultra-endurance athletes may require as many as 6000 calories per
day or more just to maintain their weight! Calorie requirements may also
vary among otherwise identical individuals due to differences in inherited
metabolic rates...

Ahh I see - so something like 75% of the maintenance diet, or 50% of the
building diet?

It is interesting to see the scientific side of what I try to do more by feel than
anything.

Snider, Look forward to meeting and competing with you in Maine!

will barron wrote: 600 grams a day? you're a machine...thats alot of chewing.

and a alot of drinking of protein shakes.. sucks to me sometimes.. especially when I need to go potty

You guys think to much, just eat !!
alot

I need a bucket!